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2020 subwoofer thread [updated 1/20]

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  • Originally posted by Chane M&C View Post

    I don't think we'll studio these subs - too little margin in them to pay for photography and demand is high already anyway. Please see this thread for links to the original setup manuals.

    No port plugs for a product like this. You'll want to run them in reflex mode all the time.
    Hmm, I guess I'll wait for the twin 10" opposed model and see how it lines up in terms of price. :)
    New system: Outlaw RR2160 receiver; speakers & subs TBD!

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    • Originally posted by cgramer View Post
      Hmm, I guess I'll wait for the twin 10" opposed model and see how it lines up in terms of price. :)
      Jon has said $699 as a tentative price, but it's a ways out, so it might change +/-.

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      • Originally posted by jwskud View Post
        Jon has said $699 as a tentative price, but it's a ways out, so it might change +/-.
        $369 > $699 is quite a jump. Not saying it's not a good price, just a big gap. Others to come to fill in that gap, I suppose? :)

        Thanks for the info!
        New system: Outlaw RR2160 receiver; speakers & subs TBD!

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        • Originally posted by cgramer View Post
          $369 > $699 is quite a jump. Not saying it's not a good price, just a big gap. Others to come to fill in that gap, I suppose? :)
          Thanks for the info!
          There is supposed to be an aluminum cone driver coming, and also some Chane-designed permanent subwoofers. Jon doesn't want to reveal too much too early b/c we all get a little nutty and hyper. ha

          The 600 watt dual-driver is (in my opinion) a pretty hefty upgrade from the 550; see details in posts above. For example, HERE and the immediately preceding post(s).
          Last edited by jwskud; 07-31-2020, 07:40 PM.

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          • Originally posted by cgramer View Post
            $369 > $699 is quite a jump. Not saying it's not a good price, just a big gap. Others to come to fill in that gap, I suppose? :)
            Oh, I forgot to mention - Jon has also said he's working on monster sub that will be about $5k...so yes, a bit of a price gap!! Every time I think of it I just see Marty McFly getting blown across Doc Brown's lab in Back to the Future...

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            • Originally posted by Chane M&C View Post
              Good timing: Just got off the phone with the plant. We've decided to add some more padding in the cartons so we're shooting for Tuesday.
              Again, for all those ordering (or on the fence), I'll just point out that Jon has improved the packing method/materials for these three subwoofers several times now and even test-shipped a subwoofer(s) to make sure they make it to our homes intact. Stellar. And he's only charging us $25 per sub to ship, taking a hit by subsidizing the cost. Thanks to you, Jon Lane!

              I got home from vacation this afternoon and I have a lot of anxiety about my dual 550s arriving. Nothing but excitement about the actual subs. And little but trepidation regarding incorporation of REW and miniDSP for dialing in. The tutorials make it look easy enough...famous last words! My room is as far from ideal as you could imagine. We'll see how I do whenever I get the time to work on it (and get the family to go away/be quiet for a few hours/days!).

              I'll be posting my full impressions but not until I've maximized placement and response. I want these to be properly dialed in first. I will probably test one initially (and post impressions) against the Klipsch R120SW I currently run, however, just to see/show how much better even one TAI-550 is.

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              • I'm pricing out a REW miniDSP. I watched a few youtube videos and the procedure appears a bit tedious and clunky but the end result speaks for itself. Hopefully the two 550's I receive show well.

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                • Originally posted by kabin View Post
                  I'm pricing out a REW miniDSP. I watched a few youtube videos and the procedure appears a bit tedious and clunky but the end result speaks for itself. Hopefully the two 550's I receive show well.
                  If going duals, UMIK-1 (~$100), REW (free), and a miniDSP 2x4HD (~$210) are vital to maximizing returns on investment! Let's get the most out of these dual 550s! I just hope I don't wind up throwing the UMIK-1 out the window out of frustration.

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                  • I went with a TAI-300. As tempting as it is to go with the 550, I think the 300 is plenty for my needs right now.

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                    • Originally posted by BufordTJustice View Post
                      You nailed it. Cheapies for the crawl and real cable for the permanent location.

                      They don’t sound the same. Anybody who says they do has tin ears or doesn’t know how to look at cable specs. With the current prices of the cables I listed, there’s no reason not to use a quality cable. Throw in BJC as another option using coaxial Belden stock and there’s just no reason to go cheaper.
                      Hey BTJ,
                      Regarding better cables and right-angle adapters - is it better to have a curve in a cable and maintain the same cable throughout (I'm guessing no from your previous post, as I'd have to have close to 90-degree turns in 3 locations to get around my fireplace) or is it better to have multiple cables connected with right-angle RCA adapters? In my case, I'd use 3 adapters for my farthest sub...is that ok? Is there a point where it's just too many cables connected by too many adapters? I'd assume not, if the adapters are high-quality.

                      Any recommendations on right-angle RCA adapters? Mediabridge? https://smile.amazon.com/Mediabridge..._t2_B078J1MF35

                      Something cheaper?
                      Last edited by jwskud; 08-01-2020, 07:17 PM.

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                      • Originally posted by jwskud View Post
                        Hey BTJ,
                        Regarding better cables and right-angle adapters - is it better to have a curve in a cable and maintain the same cable throughout (I'm guessing no from your previous post, as I'd have to have close to 90-degree turns in 3 locations to get around my fireplace) or is it better to have multiple cables connected with right-angle RCA adapters? In my case, I'd use 3 adapters for my farthest sub...is that ok? Is there a point where it's just too many cables connected by too many adapters? I'd assume not, if the adapters are high-quality.

                        Any recommendations on right-angle RCA adapters? Mediabridge? https://smile.amazon.com/Mediabridge..._t2_B078J1MF35

                        Something cheaper?
                        You really want to only use those adapters at the end of a single cable. They add impedance and can be sources of internal reflections when you start stacking them, stuff gets wonky real fast.

                        I’ve used these and the AudioQuest adapters with good results.

                        Mediabridge RCA Right Angle Adapter - 90° Female to Male Gold-Plated Connector - 5 Pack - (Part# CONN-RCA-RA-5PK) https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00OYD2M..._8ZGjFbZ7EVEZZ

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                        • Originally posted by BufordTJustice View Post
                          You really want to only use those adapters at the end of a single cable. They add impedance and can be sources of internal reflections when you start stacking them, stuff gets wonky real fast.
                          Ahh, ok, I misunderstood your original post. So it's better to use one continuous RCA cable, even if it requires a few sharp turns, than using these 90-degree adapters and multiple, shorter cables. Well, good - that means I don't have to spend any more money for once!

                          [by sharp turns, I don't mean forcing a cable into a 90-degree turn, but simply curving it around a 90-degree turn...]

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                          • Originally posted by jwskud View Post
                            Ahh, ok, I misunderstood your original post. So it's better to use one continuous RCA cable, even if it requires a few sharp turns, than using these 90-degree adapters and multiple, shorter cables. Well, good - that means I don't have to spend any more money for once!

                            [by sharp turns, I don't mean forcing a cable into a 90-degree turn, but simply curving it around a 90-degree turn...]
                            Yeah, you want to observe the minimum bend radius for that cable. Generally a 2” circle is about what you can get away with. And remember that bending a shield much can reduce its effectiveness.

                            The 90 degree adapters are for strain relief at the end(s) of the cable and to enable sub placement very close to a wall for situations that require it.
                            Last edited by BufordTJustice; 08-03-2020, 05:29 PM.

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                            • So I was referred here by some people over on Audioholics. TheJman suggested I check out your subwoofer offerings. I am trying to fill a 4000 cu ft area (basement with carpet over concrete floor) with decent bass (Not a bass head, but do like a kick in the butt every once in a while). Also, I do not plan to watch movies at reference levels. All HT use.....pretty much zero music. I am extremely intrigued with your sub offerings, as they are a great size (my wife would approve and thank you tremendously), and lets face it, the price is killer! More specifically, I was looking at getting (2) TAI-300's. Thoughts? My budget is pretty tight at the $600-ish mark max. I could corner load them both....and would you suggest stacking them? Another option would be to corner load one, and put the other on the other side of the TV midwall. Dimensions of the room are 20'(front wall) x 25'(side wall) x 8'. MLP is about 13' away.

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                              • Originally posted by Border411 View Post
                                So I was referred here by some people over on Audioholics. TheJman suggested I check out your subwoofer offerings. I am trying to fill a 4000 cu ft area (basement with carpet over concrete floor) with decent bass (Not a bass head, but do like a kick in the butt every once in a while). Also, I do not plan to watch movies at reference levels. All HT use.....pretty much zero music. I am extremely intrigued with your sub offerings, as they are a great size (my wife would approve and thank you tremendously), and lets face it, the price is killer! More specifically, I was looking at getting (2) TAI-300's. Thoughts? My budget is pretty tight at the $600-ish mark max. I could corner load them both....and would you suggest stacking them? Another option would be to corner load one, and put the other on the other side of the TV midwall. Dimensions of the room are 20'(front wall) x 25'(side wall) x 8'. MLP is about 13' away.
                                Big room. I'll preface this by stating most folks will recommend buying the best (most powerful, lowest extension) subwoofer you can afford, then save up and buy a second. But you're on a budget (good to hear it's not just me!), the TAI-300 and 550 are limited-run (and thereby limited availability in the future), and you're not a bass head.

                                As such, I'm thinking dual 300s will be fine. The 550 gives about 2 dB more and slightly more output down low, but dual 300s are no slouches based on what we've heard here, and dual 300s with shipping will run you just $650, vs. $790 for dual 550s.

                                As far as corner loading, it's generally a good idea for maximizing output, and THIS REVIEW states that the Snell Basis 300 benefited from such for HT purposes. Corner loading can increase boominess, however, so you should still do a sub crawl.

                                As far as placement of the second, well, that gets complicated. If you have a good cell phone, you can try THIS METHOD, but most cell phone microphones are crappy and don't pick up much below 40 Hz. So your mileage may vary.

                                Regardless, dual corner-loading is an option, as are any of the options you suggest. The only way to know is to try different placements, or perhaps just use a sub crawl to place the first, put it in position, then put the second sub in the MLP and try a second sub crawl with both subs running...but I've never tried that, so I don't know how well it works.

                                You can also read THIS massive document for optimal placement (in optimal rooms); slide 75 shows typical best-fit solutions.

                                As far as output and extension, the 300 should reach mid- to low-20s with good output. You shouldn't expect a ton of tactile response (floor vibration) on concrete, but if the 300 is equal to the RSL Speedwoofer 10s (and it should be, if not better), that particular sub has been cited for having "fun" and "exciting" bass in the 30-60 Hz (chest-punch) range, so you should do fine.

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