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Behringer Amp comparison...
Behringer EP4000 amp in comparison to the Dayton SA1000 amp...
In discussions with Craig and doing other research in the 1 year+ of owning the CS 18.T, I know that my set-up is contributing to running the Dayton amp at full potential. I would get things dialed in for one demanding LFE movie and all would be well until the next demanding movie came along and the Dayton amp would go into protection mode due to the input signal. I tried various combinations of Audyssey On/Off, Behringer Feedback Destroyer (BFD) in Studio mode (+4dBu) and Home mode (-10dBV), AVR sub trim levels and gain levels on the Dayton amp. When I shaped the input signal to play it safe, it left me wanting more and when I tried to get the most out of the amp, the protection circuit kicked in. After reading many threads on the various other amps available, I decided to try another amp with the 18.T and was able to locate and purchase a Behringer EP4000.
Here is my current set-up:
Dedicated, sealed 3000 cubic foot theater room.
Onkyo 805 AVR.
BFD set to Home mode.
Audyssey ON.
OmniMic measurement software.
I watch movies at reference level or a master volume of 0.0dB on the 805.
The first thing I did was run a single sub off each amp. This allowed me to set-up and EQ each individual sub with the BFD and re-run Audyssey. I started to run all of the demanding scenes that gave me problems and the Dayton amp sailed through with no problems...on the surface, it appears that the Dayton amp liked driving the single sub with my current equipment. I was able to set-up both amps to drive the subs aggressively and had a noticeable improvement in reproducing bass heavy movies.
Next up, I set-up one sub on each channel of the EP4000, ran Audyssey again and didn't notice much difference from the previous set-up. After checking the specs on the Behringer amp, I sent a PM to Craig to inquirer about running the amp in bridged mode. I also noticed another thread here where Gorilla83 posted that he was running his 18.T this way and shot him a PM as well...each replied back that is was OK.
I decided to go very slowly with this new set-up and after playing around with the input signal from the Onkyo 805, I decided to try and set the BFD to Studio mode, the sub trim level to 0.0dB in the AVR and set the gain on the EP4000 to produce 78dB at my listening position with the test tone from the AVR. I ran Audyssey and for the first time, it set my sub trim level to +1.0dB...in the past it would always be -15.0dB to -10.0dB. This was the first time that Audyssey correctly added another foot of distance to the distance setting of the sub to compensate for the BFD.
I was actually a bit apprehensive to go all out with these settings...so I started slowly with low bass level scenes from Tron:Legacy and could not believe how good these scenes sounded. The BFD input level was showing all green bars and I was in no danger of clipping the input signal to the EP4000. Now I am ready for the big scenes and go to the scene where Sam enters the grid and I was floored...I have listened to these scenes at least 50 times and I could not get over the improvement. There is a definite increase in SPL but it is the "weight" of the sound now. I have no doubt that my current equipment likes the EP4000 amp and plays better with it vs. the Dayton amp.
This is by no means a knock on the Dayton amp...my equipment, room and listening habits prefer the sound of the EP4000. Kudos to Craig for going with a separate amp to begin with and to continue to investigate other options. In the coming weeks I am going to try different crossover settings, Audyssey On/Off and placement of the 18.T in my room as well as a flat FR vs. a house curve...I suspect that I will be driving my Wife and neighbor crazy during the new year.
Happy New Year to all here at CHT! :)
In discussions with Craig and doing other research in the 1 year+ of owning the CS 18.T, I know that my set-up is contributing to running the Dayton amp at full potential. I would get things dialed in for one demanding LFE movie and all would be well until the next demanding movie came along and the Dayton amp would go into protection mode due to the input signal. I tried various combinations of Audyssey On/Off, Behringer Feedback Destroyer (BFD) in Studio mode (+4dBu) and Home mode (-10dBV), AVR sub trim levels and gain levels on the Dayton amp. When I shaped the input signal to play it safe, it left me wanting more and when I tried to get the most out of the amp, the protection circuit kicked in. After reading many threads on the various other amps available, I decided to try another amp with the 18.T and was able to locate and purchase a Behringer EP4000.
Here is my current set-up:
Dedicated, sealed 3000 cubic foot theater room.
Onkyo 805 AVR.
BFD set to Home mode.
Audyssey ON.
OmniMic measurement software.
I watch movies at reference level or a master volume of 0.0dB on the 805.
The first thing I did was run a single sub off each amp. This allowed me to set-up and EQ each individual sub with the BFD and re-run Audyssey. I started to run all of the demanding scenes that gave me problems and the Dayton amp sailed through with no problems...on the surface, it appears that the Dayton amp liked driving the single sub with my current equipment. I was able to set-up both amps to drive the subs aggressively and had a noticeable improvement in reproducing bass heavy movies.
Next up, I set-up one sub on each channel of the EP4000, ran Audyssey again and didn't notice much difference from the previous set-up. After checking the specs on the Behringer amp, I sent a PM to Craig to inquirer about running the amp in bridged mode. I also noticed another thread here where Gorilla83 posted that he was running his 18.T this way and shot him a PM as well...each replied back that is was OK.
I decided to go very slowly with this new set-up and after playing around with the input signal from the Onkyo 805, I decided to try and set the BFD to Studio mode, the sub trim level to 0.0dB in the AVR and set the gain on the EP4000 to produce 78dB at my listening position with the test tone from the AVR. I ran Audyssey and for the first time, it set my sub trim level to +1.0dB...in the past it would always be -15.0dB to -10.0dB. This was the first time that Audyssey correctly added another foot of distance to the distance setting of the sub to compensate for the BFD.
I was actually a bit apprehensive to go all out with these settings...so I started slowly with low bass level scenes from Tron:Legacy and could not believe how good these scenes sounded. The BFD input level was showing all green bars and I was in no danger of clipping the input signal to the EP4000. Now I am ready for the big scenes and go to the scene where Sam enters the grid and I was floored...I have listened to these scenes at least 50 times and I could not get over the improvement. There is a definite increase in SPL but it is the "weight" of the sound now. I have no doubt that my current equipment likes the EP4000 amp and plays better with it vs. the Dayton amp.
This is by no means a knock on the Dayton amp...my equipment, room and listening habits prefer the sound of the EP4000. Kudos to Craig for going with a separate amp to begin with and to continue to investigate other options. In the coming weeks I am going to try different crossover settings, Audyssey On/Off and placement of the 18.T in my room as well as a flat FR vs. a house curve...I suspect that I will be driving my Wife and neighbor crazy during the new year.
Happy New Year to all here at CHT! :)
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