Give me your thoughts on these subs for bedroom

[alphaiii]

I'm looking for a relatively compact sub for a bedroom 3.1 setup, mostly for movies, but a little music listening as well. The sub will be paired with Energy RC-10's and Energy RC-Mini Center. I want as tight and clean of bass as possible. The sub will sit on an Auralex Subdude.

Here are the subs I'm considering:

Mirage Prestige S8 - Yeah I know the 26Hz -3dB is a very optimistic rating (in-room, best case scenario), but I don't need extremely low extension. It's a nice looking sub, and compact. It is front firing/rear ported, but I can give it 8" clearance in the back.

HSU STF-1 - It's not going to win any beauty contests, but HSU's rep can't be ignored. It's deeper than the S8, so rear port clearance will only be about 5". It's only rated to 32Hz (-2dB), but I imagine it plays just about as low as the S8.

Chrysalis Starfire-10/Veldoyne Impact-10 - These appear to be the same sub, just different name and asthetics. Rated to 32Hz @ -3dB. An advantage is that they're front firing/bottom ported, so rear wall bass reinforcement isn't an issue. Not sure if they stack up to the S8, or moreso, the STF-1, though.

Thoughts?

[dvenardos]

This price point is going to be the sweet spot for TCA.

Only other thing to consider might be this:

http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/index.php?topic=65684.0

You could have ed build the box for you.

[alphaiii]

It does look like TCA will have a couple strong options in my price range, but I have no idea when they will be available. I'm not a big fan of waiting to unreleased products with unknown ETA.

I will look into the GR/Apex build. I wonder what eD would charge to build the box...

[dweekie]

http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/index.php?topic=65525.0

Why not just buy a different complete package?

-I guess the pricing is a bit higher...

[alphaiii]

The GR servo kit is out of my price range right now. Besides, that sub would overkill for my bedroom - it'd better serve as a replacement for the Acculine Asub in my living room.

[dvenardos]

I will look into the GR/Apex build. I wonder what eD would charge to build the box...

I really like them a lot. I had them build the GR av-1rs boxes in bare mdf. I sent them a pdf and they had me a quote in two days. Plus they are using a non-toxic mdf (efs) for all their work now.

[alphaiii]

Thanks for the inputs guys.

I've decided to rule out the GR build. Just the driver and Apex amp will run me $245 plus shipping, and then I still need a box. That's just more than I want to spend for a bedroom sub.

I also think I have to rule out the HSU. Here's my reasoning - feel free to give your input on this too, please.

The HSU is rear ported, and is also 16" deep. I am only looking at about 5" port clearance from the back wall, which happens to be a connecting wall to a neighboring townhouse. These walls aren't exactly well insulated for sound - some I'm thinking having the port pounding so close to that wall is a good way to piss off the neighbors.

Also, the HSU will run me $279.

I can get the Prestige S8 brand new for $251. I know it is also rear ported, but I'll have more like 8" of rear clearance. Do you think this will make enough of a difference to have less reinforcement on that back wall - and therefore less likely to drive the neighbors nuts? Also, this sub will easily fit on the SubdudeHD.

On the other hand, I can get the Chrysalis Starfire 10 (same sub as Velodyne Impact 10) brand new for $209. So I'd be getting the best deal with this, and also the longest warranty on the electronics. Not to mention, I'm now looking at a bottom ported (with port firing into the SubdudeHD) and front firing.

I imagine I'd be giving up some performance if I go with the Chrysalis, but I wonder how much relative to the Prestige S8.

Prestige has WAF, better specs (although probably a bit inflated), higher power amp....but is rear ported and has a smaller driver.

Chrysalis is $42 cheaper, has 2 years more on amp warranty, bottom port and larger driver...but is only rated to 32Hz -3dB and has less amp.


So between the Prestige S8 and Chrysalis - thoughts?

[sbisheff]

Just to throw a little curve ball in here, what about a used X-Sub? They have a -3db point of 28hz and are a great little front ported, downfiring sub. They are quick for music and do great for HT. You should be able to pick up a used one for around $150 I'd think. I loved my little X-Sub and if you want one that's a little more fancy, someone may have an extra Piano Rosewood one laying around.

Just my 2cents :D

[alphaiii]

Just to throw a little curve ball in here, what about a used X-Sub? They have a -3db point of 28hz and are a great little front ported, downfiring sub. They are quick for music and do great for HT. You should be able to pick up a used one for around $150 I'd think. I loved my little X-Sub and if you want one that's a little more fancy, someone may have an extra Piano Rosewood one laying around.

Just my 2cents :D

Well, I had an x-sub...actually 2 for a brief point.

I owned one for about a year - it suffered from low ouput/low sensitivity issue. No air leak, and I never pulled the driver to check for fallen damping material, but I couldn't get alot of output from it when connected to an AVR (Panasonic XR55 and Marantz SR3001). When connected to Gizmo, I got alot more - I'm assuming due to stronger pre-out signal? - and was, for the 1st time, impressed with what an x-sub could do.

Anyway, I was willing to live with the AVR sub gain to max, and the x-sub gain to around 2/3, but then the amp developed a hum and would thump whenever going into standby. I got in touch with Mark J, and was told it was possible the amp would fail. So I waited a couple weeks for a replacement, only to have one corner of the plate amp serverely bend - even if I tried to bend it back, I don't think I could've gotten an air tight seal with the cabinet.

I sent back the replacement, and with a few more weeks of no idea if/when I could get another replacement amp, I sent the whole sub back and washed my hands of it.

The 2nd I bought was used, and had the same issues with amp hum and auto-off thumping. I returned it to the original owner, who ended up returning it to av123.

Given my experiences with the x-subs, I have decided I will not buy any av123 subs until they prove they can provide RELIABLE amps (I think the MFW amp and ULW-10 amp issues more than support my decision); and I won't buy a used sub without a transferrable warranty on the amp.

Thanks for the recommendation Skeeter, but unfortunately I just can't justify gambling on another x-sub - especially when replacement amps are all but impossible to get now. It's unfortunate, because so many were impressed with the earlier China produced x-subs. Not to mention, they looked great and were very compact. It just seems that somewhere along the way, QC on these things disappeared.

[sbisheff]

Well, I had an x-sub...actually 2 for a brief point.

I owned one for about a year - it suffered from low ouput/low sensitivity issue. No air leak, and I never pulled the driver to check for fallen damping material, but I couldn't get alot of output from it when connected to an AVR (Panasonic XR55 and Marantz SR3001). When connected to Gizmo, I got alot more - I'm assuming due to stronger pre-out signal? - and was, for the 1st time, impressed with what an x-sub could do.

Anyway, I was willing to live with the AVR sub gain to max, and the x-sub gain to around 2/3, but then the amp developed a hum and would thump whenever going into standby. I got in touch with Mark J, and was told it was possible the amp would fail. So I waited a couple weeks for a replacement, only to have one corner of the plate amp serverely bend - even if I tried to bend it back, I don't think I could've gotten an air tight seal with the cabinet.

I sent back the replacement, and with a few more weeks of no idea if/when I could get another replacement amp, I sent the whole sub back and washed my hands of it.

The 2nd I bought was used, and had the same issues with amp hum and auto-off thumping. I returned it to the original owner, who ended up returning it to av123.

Given my experiences with the x-subs, I have decided I will not buy any av123 subs until they prove they can provide RELIABLE amps (I think the MFW amp and ULW-10 amp issues more than support my decision); and I won't buy a used sub without a transferrable warranty on the amp.

Thanks for the recommendation Skeeter, but unfortunately I just can't justify gambling on another x-sub - especially when replacement amps are all but impossible to get now. It's unfortunate, because so many were impressed with the earlier China produced x-subs. Not to mention, they looked great and were very compact. It just seems that somewhere along the way, QC on these things disappeared.

Hey I TOTALLY understand your line of thinking and I'd be very wary as well. Mine was a China version that I bought used and had zero issues but you're right, the last batch definitely was a crap shoot for reliability. I have to say those PR ones just look gorgeous though!

Good luck with the search and let us know what you decide on :thumbsup:

[dvenardos]

There are also the Dayton Elites which are HSU designs:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-390

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-392

[alphaiii]

First off, thanks to everyone for their input.

I've decided to go with the Mirage Prestige S8. What little I can find on the Mirage Prestige/Energy ESW-V subs all points to them being solid performers with tight, clean bass - just what I'm looking for.

I was seriously considering the HSU STF-1, but went against it for a few reasons. Primarily, given the connected townhome living situation, I think the S8 will be a little more neighbor friendly. Not that I necessarily think the STF-1 will substantially outperform it in extension or SPL...but the Mirage is front firing instead of down firing, and it's cabinet is less deep, providing more port clearance (given the placement options, I could only give the STF-1 about 3-4" clearance.)

Will the extra 3" of rear clearance or front firing design of the S8 in any way help with not angering the neighbors....well, from what I can gather, no or maybe. Many don't seem to think front vs down firing will be any difference in terms of floor/wall resonance, but some do. And while that exta 3' of rear clearance probably won't save that back wall, I guess every little bit helps.

But these considerations, along with slightly higher FR of the S8 (which is important since my RC-Mini center has to be crossed at 100Hz or higher), and the S8 being a bit cheaper, more compact, and alot nicer looking....I've decided to go that route.

I will say that in the few boards I posted my original question, the STF-1 was the overwhelming favorite. But, despite the advice, I had to go with what made the most sense to me for my needs and my personal preferences.

[alphaiii]

I should add, the Chrysalis/Velodyne was an attractive option at first. The front firing/bottom ported design seemed as though it would be the most neighbor friendly and easiest to place. Not to mention, if has the poorest extension, despite having a 10" driver.

When I found out I could get the Chrysalis 10 for $209 shipped (brand new w/ warranty)...it was an even more attractive option.

So I did a little digging to get some feedback on that sub, and I came across a couple things that pushed me back to the S8.

Less solid cabinet construction - the more expensive Chrysalis Photon is constructed of 1/2" MDF, so I have to assume the Starfire 10 is as well.

Poor extension - one of the very few reviews of the Starfire 10 I could find measured it dropping from 100dB at 50Hz to 87dB at 30Hz....-13dB at 30Hz isn't very impressive. While less low end output would probably be the smarter choice in my living situation - I couldn't bring myself to sacrifice that much....I mean come on, I'm already sacrificing by getting a small sub in the first place, right?!?!.

And the last, although a minor annoyance - the captive power cord on the amp - my current bedroom sub (tSC ASW-8) has a captive cord, and it's irritating to know that if I shift things around, I always have to be mindful that the amp's cord can reach the surge protector's outlet. Having a detachable cord is just a nice feature to have, just in case.

That said, the Starfire 10 is probably well worth $209, and appears to be a nice, affordable sub. The S8 just seemed to be a better option for me.